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Attending: Oliver, Paul, AlexA, AlexN, Chris, Bing(forJoanna), MikhailV

TPTP 4.5 Discussion

Oliver asks if there are any crises for current iteration?

Joanna has noted some items to slip from iteration

  • Some probably need to slip all the way out of 4.5
  • Decision to have detailed discussion at next AG call

AG call to focus on technical issues and PMC to cover non-technical discussion topics

  • Would like to set up new AG time
  • Try to arrange time so Harm and Oliver can come as well
  • There was some discussion around possible times. Decision to coordinate via email.
  • Summarize in AG call next week all deferrals from all projects.
    • Harm is committed to ensuring that feedback regarding IBM concerns around proposed deferrals happens in timely manner.

Oliver asks if there are any other topics to discuss around I6?

  • Paul having problems running some tests with Equinox P2
    • Any new news here?
    • AlexN also not able to run automated tests there either
    • Paul notes the need to copy as-is component over into agent controller area
      • Question: Is anyone else having problems with IAC?

Followups from F2F

Components and Projects

It seems that trace and profile have some extra back and forth between INTC and IBM for project management

  • Desire to unify much of profiling under AlexA
  • AlexA and Mikhail have had discussions around tihs
    • Next step is to talk thru it with Joanna
  • AlexA also needs to talk to Joanna to get more details about what IBM's resourcing on profiler bits is.

Oliver asks whether Paul might want to take over the portions of platform that are primarily used for test project

  • Paul states that this is more or less how things are now
  • Exception: A few modeling components and such are managed under platform today.

Oliver asks AlexN are any efficiency changes needed for Monitoring?

  • AlexN does not think so but...
    • Some of log and trace bits are currently part of platform and reporting is done indirectly thru Joanna

EPP Effort

Joel had action item to report to PMC about EPP test. He might not have seen it.

  • Action item pushed to next week.
  • AI Bing to make sure Joel is on track.

Post 4.5 Resourcing

Oliver is starting to actively press for post 4.5 strategy discussion as a precursor to getting resource commitments for the next release.

  • Goal: Express strategy that will encourage participants to commit to flat or up resourcing
  • There were a number of people using/consuming bits of TPTP from EclipseCon
    • Only one commercial product seems to use it though

Two basic options exist at this point

  • Quiesce/maintenance only some large chunks of the code
  • Lay out plan for a few key use cases and consolodate effort around those areas moving to as-is on other parts.
    • This approach would most impact IBM who has product consumptions of large pieces of TPTP

Possible ways to move forward

  • Community user focused development
    • Intel probably okay with a community based solution since they want direct developer adoption of TPTP
    • IBM may need to be convinced such investment in non-commercial userbase is important.

Oliver has concerns when he sees committed enhancements being pushed out of 4.5

  • That it sets us up for a problem with TPTP not meeting expectations
  • Looking forward, would like to see us clarify exactly what the partial resources will be doing
    • Get permission to move HC around a bit more

AlexN summarized a few of his TPTP 4.5 experiences wrt partial resources

  • IT is quite hard to extract value from part time resources
  • Oliver will be looking into this more
  • Realistically getting rid of all PT is unlikely but hope to coalesce most of the 10% folks.
  • Alex' examples help underscore some needs to make changes.

Oliver willing to take on discussion w/ IBM about ramping down some bits IBM cares about in the interest of ramping up on a few key areas.

  • If PMC believes it would work and be desirable
    • Example: SAP memory profiler
      • IBM should have interest in getting heap analaysis for Java
      • IBM could in theory save money on their free memory profiler stuff if this succeeds
    • Example: Erikson Trace stuff
      • Oliver is not yet sure what the tie in to IBM interest areas may be but he is thinking about it.
    • Example: AMD profiler visualization (EPL at sourceforge) could have some tie in as well if they could be brought into project.

AI Leads to come back next week with some strategic areas for discussion where focus should be made (and/or quiese should happen)

  • Question came up whether this was to be an open ended discussion or if we want to have a concrete timeline for the discussion
    • Oliver doesn't want to delay too long. Wants to go talk to key players sooner rather than later.
    • Everyone should go forth and discuss items. Bring ideas back on 2nd for PMC discussion
    • "Final" discussion on 9th.
    • Oliver to send out strategy concept to key companies in mid April

Preparation for June 18 Board presentation

Presentation content will depend on our decision of April 9th and feedback we're getting from key companies.

  • Oliver plans to use fact that he will go to board on June 18th in order to try to press participants to commit sooner rather than later.
  • Presentation to board would include ideas about how project will work moving forward
    • If on other hand resourcing discussion indicates that we will quiesce a bunch
    • Because this will have visibility to board, some companies may be more willing to commit.


AlexA will be out on vacation for 2 PMC calls. Mikhail Voronin will be present on his behalf.

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