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= Meeting Minutes =
 
= Meeting Minutes =
−
'''August 21, 2013''' - Dani, John, Andrew, Martin
+
'''April 16, 2014''' - Dani, Alex
−
* Dani: '''Still need the links to the torrents?''' Can we measure usage of torrents ? "Eclipse SDK" traffic is low these days anyways, would make sense for EPP only if ever
+
* no topics today
−
* Martin: Some traffic these days on the [http://dev.eclipse.org/mhonarc/lists/eclipse-scripting-dev/ eclipse-scripting-dev] mailing list
+
−
** John: Some UI would likely be simpler with e4 now ...
+
−
** e4 would be a possible initial place for the project (incubator), initial basic hooks could even be put into the Platform
+
−
* Luna M1 went pretty well
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
−
'''August 14, 2013''' - Dani, Andrew
 
−
* Dani: no changes to release pace for Luna. For details see [[Planning_Council/August_7_2013]]
 
  
−
<hr/>
+
'''April 9, 2014''' - Dani, Martin, Alex
−
'''August 7, 2013''' - Dani, Andrew, Martin, McQ
+
* Dani - '''Kepler SR2 and Java 8'''
−
* Dani - '''Moving to more frequent releases''' to be discussed at the PC today
+
** Planning Council: Can build and host the patches, but messaging must be clear as "SR2 with the patches applied". Still polishing words of the download pages.
−
** McQ believes that aggregating monthly releases into a train can't work given the size of the train, so the monthly release wouldn't be useful to anyone
+
** Not added to aggregate repo ... one-time package without any updates
−
** Martin agrees that as a commercial adopter, stability (of the yearly train) is key: new features are interesting in one or two projects but not in the train
+
** Feature patch available on Marketplace (for manual update) - for those starting from scratch they can now get "Kepler + Patch"
−
** Moving faster with the train can't be at the expense of no longer getting backports of bugfixes to those releases that I have chosen to adopt !
+
** Not convinced that the extra downloads were necessary (early adopters already had the patch, new adopters can also get Luna) ... but current approach won't hurt.
−
** McQ: No more SR releases, but only converge the development streams every 4 months ? - Backports could be made but adopters would have to build themselves.
+
−
* What causes most grief when adopting a new Platform version ?
+
−
** Notifications have proven most problematic .. on either Resource / project system or XML / EMF models: subtle change of behavior can have a big impact when notifications trigger other notifications
+
−
*** Can it be fixed with a community effort ? [Not sure, most problems are in layers on top of the platform...]
+
  
−
<hr/>
+
* John - '''Hard to review all incoming Platform/UI Contributions'''
−
'''July 31, 2013''' - Dani, John, Andrew, Martin
+
** Dani tried to jump in on some issues like Icons
−
* ide-dev list : "Eclipse as an IDE" from a cross project / cross PMC point of view
+
** Doubt that some of the work will really help bringing committers on board (such as the for loop conversion)
−
** Tools + Equinox + Packages ...
+
** Some of the initial contributors of very simple things have now grown into contributing real interesting things
−
* The "Uber Package..."
+
** Getting more people involved in initial reviews (currently some 10 active committers, 4-5 fullday ones) - but mainly Eric and Paul review patches
−
** Not recommendable. Better to improve Marketplace ... not all Train projects are on the Marketplace.
+
−
** Dani: As per the downloads page, it looks like the standard package doesn't have marketplace client ? - Martin: might be filtered; might be worth a bug if not visible.
+
−
*** filed {{bug|414305}}
+
−
* Looking forward to discussions on ide-dev.
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
−
'''July 24, 2013''' - McQ, Dani, John
 
−
* Brief planning discussion. Kepler SR1 end-game plan released. Luna M1 is August 9th.
 
−
* We will resume architecture team meetings on August 7th. John to remind team next week.
 
−
* John will be away Aug 1-16
 
  
−
'''July 17, 2013''' - McQ, Dani, John, Andrew
+
'''April 2, 2014''' - Dani, Alex, John, Martin
−
* Brief discussion of the "code smells" thread on cross-project list
+
* Dani - new GTK3+ issues
−
* Overall positive discussion and we hope to see good things come out of it
+
** crash/hang when SWT AWT bridge is used, also affects JavaFX ({{bug|431330}})
 +
** problems with main menu ({{bug|419830}})
 +
* Dani - '''Submitting the IP Log for the Java 8 Work'''
 +
** Currently not qualified as a "release", only submitting the IP log.
 +
* Dani - need to '''approve API changes for Java 8 in M7'''
 +
** No API changes, only additions
 +
** Used / tested by JDT Core / JDT UI
 +
** ObjectTeams (Stephan Herrmann) was involved
 +
** There were no objections i.e. changes were approved
 +
* John - '''SWT over JavaFX'''
 +
** EclipseCon: Steve Northover thought it was possible, just a lot of work
 +
** Decide after Luna whether hosting in SWT or doing as a separate project
 +
** Relationship to Tom Schindl's [http://www.eclipse.org/efxclipse/index.html e(fx)clipse project] ?
 +
*** e(fx)clipse is more about tooling, not so much about rendering ...
 +
*** Tom seems to have an alpha version, but not actively working on it
 +
*** Seem to need some additional API in SWT - patch sits in Gerrit with nobody putting any attention at the moment. Details in {{bug|426243}}
 +
*** Having this API in place would make the JavaFX port simpler
 +
**** It look good but Alex has no idea whether it's the best idea and how acceptable on all platforms
 +
**** John: May make sense in the next release, API can't be a near-term thing ... needs some backers who can invest significant time in it
 +
*** Doug Schaefer is also pushing for JavaFX
  
−
'''June 26, 2013''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, Andrew, John
 
−
* Andrew: '''Orion Browser API Standardization'''
 
−
* John: '''More process around Kepler Maintenance Stream''' - 1 reviewer, similar to RC1 ?
 
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
−
'''June 19, 2013''' - John, Dani, Martin
+
'''March 26, 2014''' - John, Dani, Martin, Alex
−
* John/Dani: '''Kepler Retrospect'''
+
* John - '''EclipseCon Update'''
−
** JDT Versioning: Bundles and features at 3.10 for Luna, Marketing version at 4.4
+
** Slightly smaller than in the past, but VERY of positive attitude, LOT of excitement around Java 8 ... Oracle turned on the servers during one of the morning sessions
−
** Freeze Plan: Worked fine for Platform, but others on the Train didn't quite play by the rules
+
** IoT / M2M - lots of demos on Raspberry Pi, many new projects
−
*** Dani to replace John on the Planning Council (phone meeting once per month)
+
** Very good content around Orion and Javascript, but a small crowd
−
* '''Rules of Engagement for Maintenance Releases'''
+
** Great opening keynote from Mike Milinkovich on the history and future of Eclipse - mentioned Flux
−
** JDT is in the middle of a release cycle, since doing Java 8
+
** See also Blog Posts from [http://cdtdoug.ca/ Doug Schaefer] and [http://eclipsesource.com/blogs/author/irbull/ Ian Bull] as well as [https://www.eclipsecon.org/na2014/news/top-5-ian-bull top 5 from Ian]
−
* {{Bug|411132}} '''Security Advisory''' regarding raw Javadoc - Eclipse help system not vulnerable, suggest improving the docs around "Help" setting to disallow opening external links
+
* John - '''ARM port of GTK''' - any tracking items ?
 +
** Bug exists for Launchers on ARM64 ; several other items too
 +
** IBM PPC Little Endian port of SWT
 +
** Test on less used architectures like Solaris? - similar to the Windows 8 case...
 +
** Donating RHEL subscriptions to the Foundation was not accepted - John: Bug is open for having Hudson slaves run on other architectures
 +
*** Example: {{bug|430698}}, {{bug|429237}}, {{bug|415757}}; {{bug|419855}} talks about running virtualbox images on a vserver
 +
*** Denis is investigating some way running Hudson / HIPP instances on other hardware ... GTK3, Windows etc tests need other hardware
 +
*** Check for cost of hardware, companies to donate it, and people to maintain it (Security patches!)
 +
**** Alex could imagine RH signing up for some maintenance ... test machines could be entirely outside Eclipse.org infrastructure, isolated as their own sandbox
 +
**** Hudson needs access though, thus need to be careful about security
 +
* Alex - '''Java 8 vs Java 7''' currently can't build an Eclipse SDK when the build machine has only one of the JDK's
 +
** In the past, it was possible to build with only Java 7 ... now, if I have Java 8 I cannot build (need Java 7 too)
 +
** ==> Update on March 27 by Dani: this is {{bug|390889}} and we'll try to fix it for M7.
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
−
'''June 12, 2013''' - McQ, John, Martin, Dani, Andrew
+
'''March 19, 2014''' - Dani, Alex, Martin, McQ
−
* John: '''EclipseCon France Report''' - 2 day board meeting was good: strategic planning for what the Foundation should focus on
+
* McQ - '''Congrats on Java 8 Release''' to coincide with the Oracle release
−
* Dani: 4.3 ramp-down looks good ... but other projects on the release train ship significant changes late ?!?
+
* Dani - '''Windows 8 Support''' - any answer to John's E-Mail ?
−
* Dani: Java 8 looking good
+
** McQ struggles with calling it a supported platform when nobody tests it; all we need to make sure is that somebody uses it
−
* John: Planning - e4 vs compatibility layer
+
** Send note to Wayne, the epp-dev list and cross-project
−
** McQ: Because we want e4 to be a complete Platform, it makes sense to look at our own editors and see what it takes to have them run on pure e4
+
** Make it clear that running on Win8 is a useful contribution ... and we WON't put Win8 on supported platforms list if we don't get that confirmation
−
** But that's on a case-by-case basis only
+
−
** There's still a lot of confusion around e4
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
−
'''May 29, 2013''' - Dani, Andrew, Martin
+
'''March 12, 2014''' - Alex, Martin, McQ, John
−
* Dani: '''4.3 Release Update''' - looking good, some minor doc fixes only for RC4.
+
* GTK - SWT team discussions
−
* Martin: '''4.3 Standard Package''' with egit and mpc - also looking good.
+
* John - '''preparing for Java 8 release'''
−
** Minor binary diffs traced down to an "encoding" flag in the JAR format which is not significant (see {{bug|408944}})
+
−
** Automated comparison of SDK against EPP are still possible when unzipping all Jar's and comparing the contents (actually listing contents with unzip -v is also fine)
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
−
'''May 22, 2013''' - Dani, Martin, John, McQ
+
'''March 5, 2014''' - John, Dani, Martin, Alex
−
* John: '''4.3 Update''' - still 100 bugs open with 4.3 target milestone, need a reminder
+
* Dani: '''How to Avoid Spam in Gerrit''' - Bug in Bugzilla PMC bucket - consider offline
−
** There's still some [[Platform_UI/Plan/4.3 | Platform/UI 4.3 Backlog]] - some keybindings, activation, about dlg; need to make some decisions what's in or what's out
+
* Dani: '''Windows 8 Support'''
−
** Don't work on the list until the last day ... for any 2 bugs fixed, there's probably 1 introduced so need to ramp down
+
** Not listed in official plan
−
** Release review: Docs, N&N looking good
+
** No technical problem, but lack of resources - only 1 machine on the IBM team and that's a VM
−
* Google Android announcement - IntelliJ is well integrated and polished, but Eclipse has more plugins ... the 2 concepts are somewhat at odds
+
** Add as supported Platform for Luna, or wait another year ?
−
** Just one in the large ecosystem - but need to watch for a trend of others moving away
+
** Most active development is on Linux and Windows 7 these days... agree with Dani that only active developer use helps finding real issues
 +
** AI John: Send a note to eclipse-dev
 +
*** Reaching out to Community to find an active user would be sufficient ... WPF or Win32 ? WPF is only a runtime target environment as of today.
 +
* Dani: '''State of GTK 3+'''
 +
** Not yet fixed on Eclipse side, but GTK found a bug on their side that is going to be fixed; not yet sure though if that will fix everything
 +
** Launcher now has a fallback to GTK2 if it detects the partially supported GTK3 version
 +
** Good collaboration after an initial warm-up phase ... Eclipse SWT considered an important-enough client to make fixes for
 +
** Alex: Concerned about users with a GTK 3.8 distro that update to GTK 3.10 and get the fallback to GTK 2 activated which has crashes with autocomplete in the browser
 +
** On GTK 3.9 or newer, Launcher falls back to GTK 2 but that port is pretty much unmaintained, several other problems in there ... but not falling back is even worse
 +
** Should be fine once distros start picking up paint / clipping issue fix (the not-drawing fix is still pending on SWT side)
 +
* Alex: '''GTK 3 in Mars'''
 +
** Bump minimum required version to only use cairo and get rid of older calls - this causes confusion with GTK folk
 +
** RHEL 5 would no longer work
 +
** Thanks to SWT now requiring Java 1.5, can simplify the code wrt JNI
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
−
'''May 15, 2013''' - Dani, Martin, John, McQ
+
'''February 26, 2014''' - Alex, John, Martin, McQ
−
* John: Switching focus from Orion to Eclipse Platform for the endgame - will be away first week of June
+
* John: '''Orion Release''' this week
−
* Mike Milinkovich did a demo on Orion in the Zurich lab and at the Eclipse Stammtisch Zurich
+
  
−
<hr/>
+
* Alex: '''Eclipse on ARM64'''
−
'''May 8, 2013''' - Dani, Martin, John, Andrew, McQ
+
** Launcher and swt at first
−
* Dani: {{bug|403149}} '''Removing Tycho Dependency''' - AI John comment on the bug
+
** Had ports for other architectures in source form in the past, risk to get stale but helps getting the ball rolling
−
** Martin would like to see a simple Doc page somewhere that explains how to fix the versions
+
** John: Quite a lot steps to make a new Platform real - constants in OSGi, ... - but can happen piecemeal eg only do SWT first
−
** Dani thinks that any serious build would update pom versions automatically as part of the build
+
*** Martin: Would make sense to document the required steps for adding a new Platform while doing the job
−
* Martin: {{bug|402509}} context menu filtering - request gentle nudge
+
*** At least, write up the TODO list - in order to make it easier the next time
−
* John: Will '''switch to Asterisk''' for the PMC from next week on - '''AI McQ''' update the invite
+
** Should ask Tom Watson about OSGi constants
  
−
<hr/>
+
* Dani: Update on '''GTK 3+ issue''' - bug filed against GTK, working on a workaround for fallback but not yet finished
−
'''May 1, 2013''' - John, Dani, Andrew, McQ
+
** Alex: Fix in GTK3 alone wouldn't work because SWT overrides GTK in that part
−
* John: LTS now running IBM Juno maintenance builds in LTS forge. Some small details still being worked out.
+
** McQ: If SWT API can't be implemented on top of new GTK API any more, discussion needs to happen
−
* Dani: Gerrit can be configured to deny non-fast-forward merges. We agreed to request that all Eclipse project Gerrit repositories be configured in this way. See {{bug|402791}} for details.
+
*** If SWT does something wrong, would need pointers to what they should be doing instead...
−
* Dani: Request for JUnit bundle to stop re-exporting Hamcrest bundle. Hamcrest was originally part of JUnit so this was done for compatibility reasons. We agreed that we will not do this because it breaks all users of JUnit bundle. See {{bug|403676}} for details.
+
*** Maybe a couple phone calls to talk through the technical details
 +
*** Don't fight over things ... figure out what's the right thing to do, and just do it  
  
−
<hr/>
 
−
'''April 24, 2013''' - John, Dani, Martin
 
−
* Dani: '''Upload Freeze Plan'''
 
−
* Dani: '''Java 8 Update'''
 
−
* John: '''Pawel stepping down as Platform/Debug Lead'''
 
−
** Leaves Pin & Clone orphaned for next year. Working sets for expression view also not in Kepler.
 
−
 
−
<hr/>
 
−
'''April 17, 2013''' - John, Dani, Martin
 
−
* Martin: '''New Classic Package''' - Will commit SDK branding, and Egit Capability def
 
−
** CSS - Should inherit proper styling from Platform (most probably OK)
 
−
* John: '''API Baselines''' - remind teams to set API baselines
 
−
* Martin: {{bug|402509}} context menu filtering - request gentle nudge
 
−
* John: [[Platform_UI/Plan/4.3 |Triage of Platform UI issues to be addressed]]
 
−
 
−
 
−
<hr/>
 
−
'''April 3, 2013''' - McQ, Dani, John, Andrew
 
−
* John: Kepler draft plan update ready, please take a look and provide comments
 
−
* We discussed EclipseCon. It was a very good event for Eclipse project. On desktop community is moving forward on Eclipse 4. There was lots of good feedback, and very little grumbling. Orion was very well represented, lots of talks and demos from several companies adopting it.
 
−
 
−
<hr/>
 
−
'''March 20, 2013''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, Andrew
 
−
* Dani: '''Java 8''' - jdt.core making very good progress - almost everything compiles in the editor
 
−
* Dani: '''pom files update''' - to be discussed in the arch call
 
−
* Martin: {{bug|402509}} '''Context Menus''' - no feedback, ping again
 
−
* Martin: {{bug|145635}} '''Pin & Clone'''
 
−
** Dani - the feature itself is good and makes sense, would also like it in JDT
 
−
** '''The UI metaphor is new and would need some testing in the Field''' - McQ would like the patch in ASAP in a way that doesn't cause more swirl to start experimenting
 
−
** CDT would need to adopt it, upstream changes needed
 
−
** Current implementation showed quite a lot of ripples and bugs
 
−
*** Current impl breaks existing workflows, that's the big problem
 
−
** John: only 1 milestone left, if it appears in M7 and breaks any adopters they have little time to react;
 
−
*** Can loop-in JDT and CDT, but there might be others ...
 
−
*** Was PTP involved in any way ? They could also be broken, they have very special requirements
 
−
** McQ: Do we have ownership of this work ? - If we have a clear need and a clear owner working on it we could give it a try
 
−
** '''AI Martin''' (1) Clarify with CDT why they didn't like the feature and what are their plans; all the rest comes after that eg PTP, Pawel, can it be done in a non-breaking way
 
−
* John: {{bug|402912}} '''Significant Memory Leak in M6''' fixed this week: noticable if eclipse running for a long time
 
−
** Workaround for M6: Turn off Workbench Autosave feature by setting it to 0
 
−
** ''AI Post to cross-project'' - people doing demos at Eclipsecon might want to use the workaround
 
−
* Martin: {{bug|397896}} '''New Classic Package''' - initial package done but unusable while the SDK branding bundle's contents is not migrated
 
−
** Martin will continue pushing for this to happen - fallback would be not
 
−
** Not much risk in judging whether it's good or not, only binary diff needed
 
−
* John: {{bug|380325}} '''Java 7 filesystem fragment'''
 
−
** McQ do we know performance implications, could we get rid of the native bundles ?
 
−
** Martin would like to have the fragment in all builds, to make it easier to test performance etc implications
 
−
* Martin: {{bug|403589}} '''eclipse.inf'''
 
−
** Different binary bits depending on distribution channel is bad ... Tycho removed
 
−
** Defect in post-processing (why does it add eclipse.inf) or defect in bundle preparation (why isn't eclipse.inf in there) ?
 
−
** Maybe related to pack200 conditioning - Martin thinks that eclipse.inf was used in the past as a marker to know whether pack200 conditioning has happened ... now downstream aggregator conditions and adds eclipse.inf
 
−
** '''AI John investigate'''
 
−
 
−
<hr/>
 
−
'''March 13, 2013''' - McQ, John, Martin, Dani
 
−
* Andrew: '''{{bug|397896}} final throughts on the EPP package'''
 
−
** Move forward with [https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=397896#c17 ]
 
−
** Testing - could find someone if it's just "use during the test pass"
 
−
** Q: Can the EPP build be done frequently so it's available 1 week before the milestone for testing ?
 
−
* Martin: '''{{bug|402509}} context menu filtering'''
 
−
** Would like to get some advice from Platform on the approach; some trajectory of a solution moving forward
 
−
** Not a must-have for Kepler, but would like to see where this is heading
 
−
** '''AI McQ''' find Platform folk to discuss this
 
−
* John: '''Eclipse 4 API Status'''
 
−
** Publishing a "usable subset" of the former provisional API as final: model, core services; consume injection
 
−
** Allows building a real Eclipse 4 App now on API
 
−
*** Mostly clean-up, documentation; removing some bad stuff
 
−
*** Writing an App on Kepler E4 API might actually be able to run on Juno
 
−
** Some of the advanced stuff remains provisional for now, eg define injection
 
−
* John: '''Plan Update''' - No permission to update in the PMI
 
−
* McQ: '''CBI''' / Bad Launcher
 
−
** Have an idea that doing some little extra work after the CBI build might be good enough for now
 
−
** HP-UX CBI Build doesn't start out of the box (will likely stay a known issue for M6)
 
−
* Martin: '''{{bug|380325}} Java7 EFS Plugin''': Build ?
 
−
 
−
<hr/>
 
−
'''March 6, 2013''' - McQ, John, Martin, Andrew
 
−
* Martin: '''{{bug|402509}} context menu filtering'''
 
−
** AI Martin ask engineers document what we're doing today
 
−
* Martin: '''{{bug|397896}} EPP vs Classic''' - how to proceed
 
−
** Martin's recent findings on Marketplace
 
−
*** There's p2, Marketplace, Packages in the Open but they are only parts of the solution
 
−
*** There's commercial installers from EclipseSource (Yoxos), Genuitec, IBM
 
−
*** John: p2 simplified UI (eg Webtools Server Adaptors; Mylyn)
 
−
** What's missing ? David too booked ?
 
−
* John: '''CBI Builds in Kepler''' - SDK in good shape but repo and Equinox downloadpage not quite right yet, some might take until M6
 
−
* John: '''Delete old Platform/UI Branches''' - any PMC Policy ? No, convert branches to tags
 
−
* John: '''API Freeze next week''' - some (modest) new Eclipse 4 API's
 
−
** McQ recommends going for a "complete, but minimal subset of what people will want to do", rather than too many convenience methods
 
−
** John: Some API has been provisional for 3 years - can't make wholesale changes now for the fun of it
 
−
*** May phase in some changes by adding @noreference rather than deleting stuff
 
−
*** In some cases there's pressure to use interfaces rather than classes, in order to be able and leverage Java 8 constructs
 
−
* Orion - anybody going to JSConf ?
 
−
 
−
<hr/>
 
−
'''February 27, 2013''' - John, Andrew, Dani
 
−
* Nothing noteworthy
 
−
 
−
<hr/>
 
−
'''February 20, 2013''' - McQ, John, Dani, Martin, Andrew
 
−
* John: '''Orion Release Review''', please give feedback
 
−
 
−
<hr/>
 
−
'''February 13, 2013'''
 
−
* {{bug|156134}} re-exporting debug dependencies
 
−
 
−
<hr/>
 
−
'''February 6, 2013''' - John, Dani, Martin
 
−
* John: '''M5a and SR2 RC4'''
 
−
* John: Pawel and Platform / Debug work (Pin & Clone)
 
−
** Only adopt when it's really ready and satisfies all criteria, otherwise not into Kepler
 
−
** Maybe pull out Debug plugins into a feature of their own ?
 
−
 
−
<hr/>
 
−
'''January 30, 2013''' - McQ, John, Dani, Martin, Andrew
 
−
* John: '''SR2 RC3''' looking good - want to know about any remaining issues
 
−
* Dani: '''Java 8 Update''' - Markus Keller will move from JDT UI to JDT Core, taking over JSR-308
 
−
* John: '''NODE Dependency in Orion (exempt pre-req)'''
 
−
** Not shipping NODE ourselves, pushing to NODE package manager instead (or clone from git)
 
−
** Andrew: Is it a workswith ?
 
−
** Martin: Is there any overlap with the Java portion ?
 
−
*** The server code is completely distinct from Java, but the same client can interact with both
 
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
−
'''January 24, 2013''' -  
+
'''February 19, 2014''' - Dani, Alex, Martin, John
−
* Martin: '''4.3 and 3.8 dual-stream''' - [http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=webtools#themes_and_priorities Webtools project plan]
+
* Dani: '''Silenio to work on GTK issue?'''
−
** egit, mylyn, dtp have been doing both n + n-1 for a long time
+
* John: '''GTK testing at the Eclipse Foundation'''
−
** Technically, running on both should be possible if Platform API is used (except for the changes in Theming)
+
* John: '''e4 ML discussion about graduating some tools'''
−
** The Eclipse Community needs to advance the latest (4.3)
+
** Model Editor, CSS Editor, CSS Spy, ...
−
** IBM product teams have been told not to forward at all if they can't forward to 4.x - shipping on 4.2
+
** Fairly late, but risk is rather low -- suggest putting into PDE
−
** John: Having '''wider ranges of tolerance''' is something we should be able to do (otherwise our plugin system is failing)
+
** Dani concerns: No PDE committers available for handholding - and stuff is not polished; even Lars sees it in Luna+1
−
** John: Java8 will be the first killer feature in 4.x
+
** John: These tools would only be used by people building RCP apps
−
* Dani: '''Java 8'''
+
** Martin: What is the goal of trying to graduate?
−
** Will provide feature patches as soon as it makes sense - early draft, participating in expert group
+
*** If it's just about getting more exposure, perhaps keep in incubation and add to the RCP EPP Package ?
−
** Want to have the compiler and editor ready when Java 8 goes GA - initial refactoring etc in SR1 - full feature set in the next release
+
** Alex would like adding new people / interested contributors to PDE
−
* John: '''CBI update'''
+
−
** Consider switch after M5
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
−
'''January 17, 2013''' - McQ, John, Martin
+
'''February 5, 2014''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, Alex
−
* John: '''{{bug|397896}} EPP vs Classic'''
+
* Dani: '''Confcall Numbers:''' Skype into the US tollfree; Alex use SIP
−
** Could volunteer to own the EPP package from Platform POV
+
* Martin: Eclipse 4 vs Eclipse 3.x - will file defects
−
** Then Wayne would own the decision of RCP/RAP vs Classic - what's the difference, keep both or unify
+
* Alex: Testing on modern Linux
−
* John: '''Test Failures on I-Builds'''
+
−
** Move away tests that have been failing for 9 months
+
−
** Dani: Most tests are actually down to 0 failures
+
−
* John: '''CBI / Maven Builds'''
+
−
** Appears to be fragile at the moment - Maven .micro releases are breaking the build!
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
−
'''January 10, 2013''' - McQ, John, Dani, Martin
+
'''January 22, 2014''' - John, Dani, Alex, Martin
−
* McQ: '''CBI''' - Switching Platform build to CBI for SR2 is not doable
+
* John, Alex: '''New GTK 3.10 breaking Eclipse on latest Fedora'''
−
** Want to make CBI work for Juno since it's the LTS stream
+
** Alex been looking at Browser
−
** CBI SDK builds are good at this point, it's only a couple of minor issues (shape of repos, download page, ...
+
** Some Views not showing up - Silenio just back yesterday
−
** When to switch to CBI in the Kepler Stream ? - Proposal do do it immediately
+
** Dani: For 4.4m5 and 4.3.2, will document issues in the README
−
* CBI patches waiting for Platform to pick up
+
*** Considered a fallback to "gtk2" support in the Launcher, but that was considered too risky
 +
*** Silenio might have a workaround ... OK if the new code can be added conditionally for GTK 3.10 only
 +
* Dani: '''M5 Status'''
 +
** Still many open bugs not triaged - component leads should triage earlier
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
−
'''January 3, 2013''' - McQ, Andrew, John, Dani
+
'''January 15, 2014''' - McQ, Andrew, Dani, Martin
−
* Andrew will recommend good conferences to promote Orion
+
* Dani: Lakshmi (SWT Team) going on maternity leave - SWT still a decent team of 4
 +
* Andrew: PMC Participation - Suggestion
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
 +
'''January 8, 2014''' - Dani, Martin, Andrew, John, McQ
 +
* Dani: '''API Freeze''' with M6 on March 7, but JDT cannot put Java 8 stuff in before (March 18) thus will have to ask for an exception
  
 
= Archive =
 
= Archive =
 +
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2013 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2013]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2012 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2012]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2012 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2012]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2011 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2011]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2011 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2011]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2010 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2010]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2010 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2010]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2009 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2009]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2009 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2009]]

Revision as of 11:56, 16 April 2014

Documents

Some documents written and/or used by the PMC:

Meeting Schedule

The Eclipse Project PMC has a weekly phone meeting every wednesday at 10.30am EST.

Meeting Minutes

April 16, 2014 - Dani, Alex

  • no topics today

April 9, 2014 - Dani, Martin, Alex

  • Dani - Kepler SR2 and Java 8
    • Planning Council: Can build and host the patches, but messaging must be clear as "SR2 with the patches applied". Still polishing words of the download pages.
    • Not added to aggregate repo ... one-time package without any updates
    • Feature patch available on Marketplace (for manual update) - for those starting from scratch they can now get "Kepler + Patch"
    • Not convinced that the extra downloads were necessary (early adopters already had the patch, new adopters can also get Luna) ... but current approach won't hurt.
  • John - Hard to review all incoming Platform/UI Contributions
    • Dani tried to jump in on some issues like Icons
    • Doubt that some of the work will really help bringing committers on board (such as the for loop conversion)
    • Some of the initial contributors of very simple things have now grown into contributing real interesting things
    • Getting more people involved in initial reviews (currently some 10 active committers, 4-5 fullday ones) - but mainly Eric and Paul review patches

April 2, 2014 - Dani, Alex, John, Martin

  • Dani - new GTK3+ issues
    • crash/hang when SWT AWT bridge is used, also affects JavaFX (bug 431330)
    • problems with main menu (bug 419830)
  • Dani - Submitting the IP Log for the Java 8 Work
    • Currently not qualified as a "release", only submitting the IP log.
  • Dani - need to approve API changes for Java 8 in M7
    • No API changes, only additions
    • Used / tested by JDT Core / JDT UI
    • ObjectTeams (Stephan Herrmann) was involved
    • There were no objections i.e. changes were approved
  • John - SWT over JavaFX
    • EclipseCon: Steve Northover thought it was possible, just a lot of work
    • Decide after Luna whether hosting in SWT or doing as a separate project
    • Relationship to Tom Schindl's e(fx)clipse project ?
      • e(fx)clipse is more about tooling, not so much about rendering ...
      • Tom seems to have an alpha version, but not actively working on it
      • Seem to need some additional API in SWT - patch sits in Gerrit with nobody putting any attention at the moment. Details in bug 426243
      • Having this API in place would make the JavaFX port simpler
        • It look good but Alex has no idea whether it's the best idea and how acceptable on all platforms
        • John: May make sense in the next release, API can't be a near-term thing ... needs some backers who can invest significant time in it
      • Doug Schaefer is also pushing for JavaFX


March 26, 2014 - John, Dani, Martin, Alex

  • John - EclipseCon Update
    • Slightly smaller than in the past, but VERY of positive attitude, LOT of excitement around Java 8 ... Oracle turned on the servers during one of the morning sessions
    • IoT / M2M - lots of demos on Raspberry Pi, many new projects
    • Very good content around Orion and Javascript, but a small crowd
    • Great opening keynote from Mike Milinkovich on the history and future of Eclipse - mentioned Flux
    • See also Blog Posts from Doug Schaefer and Ian Bull as well as top 5 from Ian
  • John - ARM port of GTK - any tracking items ?
    • Bug exists for Launchers on ARM64 ; several other items too
    • IBM PPC Little Endian port of SWT
    • Test on less used architectures like Solaris? - similar to the Windows 8 case...
    • Donating RHEL subscriptions to the Foundation was not accepted - John: Bug is open for having Hudson slaves run on other architectures
      • Example: bug 430698, bug 429237, bug 415757; bug 419855 talks about running virtualbox images on a vserver
      • Denis is investigating some way running Hudson / HIPP instances on other hardware ... GTK3, Windows etc tests need other hardware
      • Check for cost of hardware, companies to donate it, and people to maintain it (Security patches!)
        • Alex could imagine RH signing up for some maintenance ... test machines could be entirely outside Eclipse.org infrastructure, isolated as their own sandbox
        • Hudson needs access though, thus need to be careful about security
  • Alex - Java 8 vs Java 7 currently can't build an Eclipse SDK when the build machine has only one of the JDK's
    • In the past, it was possible to build with only Java 7 ... now, if I have Java 8 I cannot build (need Java 7 too)
    • ==> Update on March 27 by Dani: this is bug 390889 and we'll try to fix it for M7.

March 19, 2014 - Dani, Alex, Martin, McQ

  • McQ - Congrats on Java 8 Release to coincide with the Oracle release
  • Dani - Windows 8 Support - any answer to John's E-Mail ?
    • McQ struggles with calling it a supported platform when nobody tests it; all we need to make sure is that somebody uses it
    • Send note to Wayne, the epp-dev list and cross-project
    • Make it clear that running on Win8 is a useful contribution ... and we WON't put Win8 on supported platforms list if we don't get that confirmation

March 12, 2014 - Alex, Martin, McQ, John

  • GTK - SWT team discussions
  • John - preparing for Java 8 release

March 5, 2014 - John, Dani, Martin, Alex

  • Dani: How to Avoid Spam in Gerrit - Bug in Bugzilla PMC bucket - consider offline
  • Dani: Windows 8 Support
    • Not listed in official plan
    • No technical problem, but lack of resources - only 1 machine on the IBM team and that's a VM
    • Add as supported Platform for Luna, or wait another year ?
    • Most active development is on Linux and Windows 7 these days... agree with Dani that only active developer use helps finding real issues
    • AI John: Send a note to eclipse-dev
      • Reaching out to Community to find an active user would be sufficient ... WPF or Win32 ? WPF is only a runtime target environment as of today.
  • Dani: State of GTK 3+
    • Not yet fixed on Eclipse side, but GTK found a bug on their side that is going to be fixed; not yet sure though if that will fix everything
    • Launcher now has a fallback to GTK2 if it detects the partially supported GTK3 version
    • Good collaboration after an initial warm-up phase ... Eclipse SWT considered an important-enough client to make fixes for
    • Alex: Concerned about users with a GTK 3.8 distro that update to GTK 3.10 and get the fallback to GTK 2 activated which has crashes with autocomplete in the browser
    • On GTK 3.9 or newer, Launcher falls back to GTK 2 but that port is pretty much unmaintained, several other problems in there ... but not falling back is even worse
    • Should be fine once distros start picking up paint / clipping issue fix (the not-drawing fix is still pending on SWT side)
  • Alex: GTK 3 in Mars
    • Bump minimum required version to only use cairo and get rid of older calls - this causes confusion with GTK folk
    • RHEL 5 would no longer work
    • Thanks to SWT now requiring Java 1.5, can simplify the code wrt JNI

February 26, 2014 - Alex, John, Martin, McQ

  • John: Orion Release this week
  • Alex: Eclipse on ARM64
    • Launcher and swt at first
    • Had ports for other architectures in source form in the past, risk to get stale but helps getting the ball rolling
    • John: Quite a lot steps to make a new Platform real - constants in OSGi, ... - but can happen piecemeal eg only do SWT first
      • Martin: Would make sense to document the required steps for adding a new Platform while doing the job
      • At least, write up the TODO list - in order to make it easier the next time
    • Should ask Tom Watson about OSGi constants
  • Dani: Update on GTK 3+ issue - bug filed against GTK, working on a workaround for fallback but not yet finished
    • Alex: Fix in GTK3 alone wouldn't work because SWT overrides GTK in that part
    • McQ: If SWT API can't be implemented on top of new GTK API any more, discussion needs to happen
      • If SWT does something wrong, would need pointers to what they should be doing instead...
      • Maybe a couple phone calls to talk through the technical details
      • Don't fight over things ... figure out what's the right thing to do, and just do it


February 19, 2014 - Dani, Alex, Martin, John

  • Dani: Silenio to work on GTK issue?
  • John: GTK testing at the Eclipse Foundation
  • John: e4 ML discussion about graduating some tools
    • Model Editor, CSS Editor, CSS Spy, ...
    • Fairly late, but risk is rather low -- suggest putting into PDE
    • Dani concerns: No PDE committers available for handholding - and stuff is not polished; even Lars sees it in Luna+1
    • John: These tools would only be used by people building RCP apps
    • Martin: What is the goal of trying to graduate?
      • If it's just about getting more exposure, perhaps keep in incubation and add to the RCP EPP Package ?
    • Alex would like adding new people / interested contributors to PDE

February 5, 2014 - McQ, Dani, Martin, Alex

  • Dani: Confcall Numbers: Skype into the US tollfree; Alex use SIP
  • Martin: Eclipse 4 vs Eclipse 3.x - will file defects
  • Alex: Testing on modern Linux

January 22, 2014 - John, Dani, Alex, Martin

  • John, Alex: New GTK 3.10 breaking Eclipse on latest Fedora
    • Alex been looking at Browser
    • Some Views not showing up - Silenio just back yesterday
    • Dani: For 4.4m5 and 4.3.2, will document issues in the README
      • Considered a fallback to "gtk2" support in the Launcher, but that was considered too risky
      • Silenio might have a workaround ... OK if the new code can be added conditionally for GTK 3.10 only
  • Dani: M5 Status
    • Still many open bugs not triaged - component leads should triage earlier

January 15, 2014 - McQ, Andrew, Dani, Martin

  • Dani: Lakshmi (SWT Team) going on maternity leave - SWT still a decent team of 4
  • Andrew: PMC Participation - Suggestion

January 8, 2014 - Dani, Martin, Andrew, John, McQ

  • Dani: API Freeze with M6 on March 7, but JDT cannot put Java 8 stuff in before (March 18) thus will have to ask for an exception

Archive

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