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= Meeting Minutes =
 
= Meeting Minutes =
'''September 19, 2012'''
+
'''May 15, 2013''' - Dani, Martin, John, McQ
* Martin: Juno patch feature for {{bug|381407}} and {{bug|383890}} ?
+
* John: Switching focus from Orion to Eclipse Platform for the endgame - will be away first week of June
 +
* Mike Milinkovich did a demo on Orion in the Zurich lab and at the Eclipse Stammtisch Zurich
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''September 12, 2012''' - Andrew, Dani, John, Martin
+
'''May 8, 2013''' - Dani, Martin, John, Andrew, McQ
* John: '''CBI Build''' - good progress with Thanh from EMO visiting Platform Team's offices this week
+
* Dani: {{bug|403149}} '''Removing Tycho Dependency''' - AI John comment on the bug
** Focus on Juno Stream because LTS builds need to get done
+
** Martin would like to see a simple Doc page somewhere that explains how to fix the versions
** Can produce an SDK but cannot produce many of the other artifacts (That's good enough for LTS which only needs a p2 repo)
+
** Dani thinks that any serious build would update pom versions automatically as part of the build
** Can claim readiness only when binary bits are the same (p2 comparator tool from Olivier - which does byte code level compare of class files, and binary comparison of other files)
+
* Martin: {{bug|402509}} context menu filtering - request gentle nudge
* John: '''4.x Performance''' - Several people on the team actively looking at issues, some problems identified, some not yet reproduced
+
* John: Will '''switch to Asterisk''' for the PMC from next week on - '''AI McQ''' update the invite
** Some work started on re-enabling Performance tests
+
** start running on virtual machines to see whether dedicated machines are needed or not
+
** How to improve the process integrating people / resources / donations from companies (EMO pushes towards more contributions)
+
*** Need more committers for longer term, not only short-term patch contributors
+
* Andrew: '''FOSDEM''' Europe (Brussels) coming up - Ian Skerret going to reserve a room, asking for people to join, good conference, lots of cross-pollination
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''September 5, 2012''' - Andrew, Dani, Martin
+
'''May 1, 2013''' - John, Dani, Andrew, McQ
* Martin: '''Windows 8''' testing ? - Filed {{bug|388560}} to get "Windows 8" added to bugzilla
+
* John: LTS now running IBM Juno maintenance builds in LTS forge. Some small details still being worked out.
** Dani: Initial testing by SWT team didn't reveal anything; Dani in favor of getting W8 deployed on Hudson once it is out officially
+
* Dani: Gerrit can be configured to deny non-fast-forward merges. We agreed to request that all Eclipse project Gerrit repositories be configured in this way. See {{bug|402791}} for details.
** Should consider adding to the Kepler plan; consider backports to Juno SR for issues found
+
* Dani: Request for JUnit bundle to stop re-exporting Hamcrest bundle. Hamcrest was originally part of JUnit so this was done for compatibility reasons. We agreed that we will not do this because it breaks all users of JUnit bundle. See {{bug|403676}} for details.
* Martin: '''3.8 vs 4.2''' - posting on [http://dev.eclipse.org/mhonarc/lists/cross-project-issues-dev/msg08123.html cross-project list]
+
** Need to look at stack traces in detail eg {{bug|385272}}. Watch how that E-Mail thread evolves.
+
* Dani: '''Go/No-Go''' decision process for RC's - to be discussed in the Arch call
+
** This got fixed by a re-spin of RC4
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''August 29, 2012:''' - John, Dani, Martin
+
'''April 24, 2013''' - John, Dani, Martin
* John: Bugzilla's new auto-duplicate-find ... Dani likes it but moved suggestions somewhere else with Greasemonkey to avoid interfering with typing
+
* Dani: '''Upload Freeze Plan'''
* Tom Watson: Big changes coming in Equinox for Java modularity - thought about Kepler but will wait for another year in a branch
+
* Dani: '''Java 8 Update'''
** Java 8 also won't be in Kepler ... so will likely be kind of a Maintenance Release
+
* John: '''Pawel stepping down as Platform/Debug Lead'''
* Dani: [[Version Numbering]] document is a bit unclear about upreving from a n.n.2
+
** Leaves Pin & Clone orphaned for next year. Working sets for expression view also not in Kepler.
** RESOLUTION: desire is clarifying the next is n.n.100
+
* Dani: '''Delete files from CVS projects''' and add a README ?
+
** Yes if it can be done in an automated way .. to avoid confusion about outdated sources
+
*** eg README points to a Wiki page
+
*** John: Keep the .project in place such that jumping from version to version doesn't break a workspace
+
*** Martin: Acceptance criterion that importing from scmurl in MANIFEST.MF still works (when choosing the tag ... choosing HEAD should bring up the README)
+
* John: '''Plan Update upcoming'''
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''August 15, 2012:''' - John, Dani, Andrew
+
'''April 17, 2013''' - John, Dani, Martin
* Do we support removal of bugzilla CLOSED state? Resolved: yes we do
+
* Martin: '''New Classic Package''' - Will commit SDK branding, and Egit Capability def
* Discussion of long term release plans beyond Kepler
+
** CSS - Should inherit proper styling from Platform (most probably OK)
 +
* John: '''API Baselines''' - remind teams to set API baselines
 +
* Martin: {{bug|402509}} context menu filtering - request gentle nudge
 +
* John: [[Platform_UI/Plan/4.3 |Triage of Platform UI issues to be addressed]]
  
<hr/>
 
'''August 8, 2012:''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, Andrew
 
* Dani: News from Jeff
 
* McQ vacation from August 13 to August 31
 
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''July 25, 2012:'''
+
'''April 3, 2013''' - McQ, Dani, John, Andrew
* '''CBI Build'''
+
* John: Kepler draft plan update ready, please take a look and provide comments
** For SR1, the build can produce what the Release Train needs ... but not all the extra validation
+
* We discussed EclipseCon. It was a very good event for Eclipse project. On desktop community is moving forward on Eclipse 4. There was lots of good feedback, and very little grumbling. Orion was very well represented, lots of talks and demos from several companies adopting it.
** Need to run both builds for now ... until the CBI team's bytecode verifier produces the same output
+
** CBI team continues to look at the list of diffs and improve their builder
+
** Platform team would be OK dropping the legacy build once the bytecode validator has no diffs
+
** Platform team can't commit more resources to CBI now (Paul Webster already heavily involved)
+
* '''Losing Commits on the Orion git repo'''
+
** Dozen commits or so
+
** Might be a defect in the Orion git tools, but the server side should prevent that !!!
+
** DenyNonFastForward should have protected ... need an extra layer of protection ?
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''June 27, 2012:''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, John
+
'''March 20, 2013''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, Andrew
* Eclipse Demo Camps - none in Ottawa
+
* Dani: '''Java 8''' - jdt.core making very good progress - almost everything compiles in the editor
* Going to skip the arch calls for all of July - leave the PMC slot in place.
+
* Dani: '''pom files update''' - to be discussed in the arch call
* Should keep an eye on the Community feedback for Eclipse 4
+
* Martin: {{bug|402509}} '''Context Menus''' - no feedback, ping again
 +
* Martin: {{bug|145635}} '''Pin & Clone'''
 +
** Dani - the feature itself is good and makes sense, would also like it in JDT
 +
** '''The UI metaphor is new and would need some testing in the Field''' - McQ would like the patch in ASAP in a way that doesn't cause more swirl to start experimenting
 +
** CDT would need to adopt it, upstream changes needed
 +
** Current implementation showed quite a lot of ripples and bugs
 +
*** Current impl breaks existing workflows, that's the big problem
 +
** John: only 1 milestone left, if it appears in M7 and breaks any adopters they have little time to react;
 +
*** Can loop-in JDT and CDT, but there might be others ...  
 +
*** Was PTP involved in any way ? They could also be broken, they have very special requirements
 +
** McQ: Do we have ownership of this work ? - If we have a clear need and a clear owner working on it we could give it a try
 +
** '''AI Martin''' (1) Clarify with CDT why they didn't like the feature and what are their plans; all the rest comes after that eg PTP, Pawel, can it be done in a non-breaking way
 +
* John: {{bug|402912}} '''Significant Memory Leak in M6''' fixed this week: noticable if eclipse running for a long time
 +
** Workaround for M6: Turn off Workbench Autosave feature by setting it to 0
 +
** ''AI Post to cross-project'' - people doing demos at Eclipsecon might want to use the workaround
 +
* Martin: {{bug|397896}} '''New Classic Package''' - initial package done but unusable while the SDK branding bundle's contents is not migrated
 +
** Martin will continue pushing for this to happen - fallback would be not
 +
** Not much risk in judging whether it's good or not, only binary diff needed
 +
* John: {{bug|380325}} '''Java 7 filesystem fragment'''
 +
** McQ do we know performance implications, could we get rid of the native bundles ?
 +
** Martin would like to have the fragment in all builds, to make it easier to test performance etc implications
 +
* Martin: {{bug|403589}} '''eclipse.inf'''
 +
** Different binary bits depending on distribution channel is bad ... Tycho removed
 +
** Defect in post-processing (why does it add eclipse.inf) or defect in bundle preparation (why isn't eclipse.inf in there) ?
 +
** Maybe related to pack200 conditioning - Martin thinks that eclipse.inf was used in the past as a marker to know whether pack200 conditioning has happened ... now downstream aggregator conditions and adds eclipse.inf
 +
** '''AI John investigate'''
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''June 13, 2012:''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, John
+
'''March 13, 2013''' - McQ, John, Martin, Dani
 
+
* Andrew: '''{{bug|397896}} final throughts on the EPP package'''
* Discussed the ECF rebuild request ({{bug|382206}}). Arguments in favor: it is a safe change, it reverts the situation to where it was in RC3 and earlier. Arguments against summarized in https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=382206#c20.
+
** Move forward with [https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=397896#c17 ]
* We will need to tag the release but we can wait until we are officially done (week of June 25th).
+
** Testing - could find someone if it's just "use during the test pass"
 +
** Q: Can the EPP build be done frequently so it's available 1 week before the milestone for testing ?
 +
* Martin: '''{{bug|402509}} context menu filtering'''
 +
** Would like to get some advice from Platform on the approach; some trajectory of a solution moving forward
 +
** Not a must-have for Kepler, but would like to see where this is heading
 +
** '''AI McQ''' find Platform folk to discuss this
 +
* John: '''Eclipse 4 API Status'''
 +
** Publishing a "usable subset" of the former provisional API as final: model, core services; consume injection
 +
** Allows building a real Eclipse 4 App now on API
 +
*** Mostly clean-up, documentation; removing some bad stuff
 +
*** Writing an App on Kepler E4 API might actually be able to run on Juno
 +
** Some of the advanced stuff remains provisional for now, eg define injection
 +
* John: '''Plan Update''' - No permission to update in the PMI
 +
* McQ: '''CBI''' / Bad Launcher
 +
** Have an idea that doing some little extra work after the CBI build might be good enough for now
 +
** HP-UX CBI Build doesn't start out of the box (will likely stay a known issue for M6)
 +
* Martin: '''{{bug|380325}} Java7 EFS Plugin''': Build ?
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''June 6, 2012:''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, John, Andrew
+
'''March 6, 2013''' - McQ, John, Martin, Andrew
 
+
* Martin: '''{{bug|402509}} context menu filtering'''
* Discussion of how to handle test failures for final build. Most of the remaining failures are infrastructure issues related to our move to Hudson for tests. We will document the failures through bugs, and include a note on the build results page for the final build explaining the failures
+
** AI Martin ask engineers document what we're doing today
* Discussion of whether we need a 3.9 release. Unanimous conclusion was that we do not see a need for it. Reducing to one stream will greatly reduce our development overhead and encourage consolidation around the single stream.
+
* Martin: '''{{bug|397896}} EPP vs Classic''' - how to proceed
* Discussion of how to handle the disappearance of org.eclipse.equinox.concurrent from our RC3 builds. This was never deliberately included in the platform, but was present due to a greedy optional dependency from ECF. By very close 3/2 decision PMC decided to leave it alone and document the disappearance in porting guide, readme file, release review material, and cross-project list.
+
** Martin's recent findings on Marketplace
 +
*** There's p2, Marketplace, Packages in the Open but they are only parts of the solution
 +
*** There's commercial installers from EclipseSource (Yoxos), Genuitec, IBM
 +
*** John: p2 simplified UI (eg Webtools Server Adaptors; Mylyn)
 +
** What's missing ? David too booked ?
 +
* John: '''CBI Builds in Kepler''' - SDK in good shape but repo and Equinox downloadpage not quite right yet, some might take until M6
 +
* John: '''Delete old Platform/UI Branches''' - any PMC Policy ? No, convert branches to tags
 +
* John: '''API Freeze next week''' - some (modest) new Eclipse 4 API's
 +
** McQ recommends going for a "complete, but minimal subset of what people will want to do", rather than too many convenience methods
 +
** John: Some API has been provisional for 3 years - can't make wholesale changes now for the fun of it
 +
*** May phase in some changes by adding @noreference rather than deleting stuff
 +
*** In some cases there's pressure to use interfaces rather than classes, in order to be able and leverage Java 8 constructs
 +
* Orion - anybody going to JSConf ?
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
 
+
'''February 27, 2013''' - John, Andrew, Dani
'''May 23, 2012:''' - McQ, Dani, Martin
+
* Nothing noteworthy
* McQ: '''CBI / Tycho builder''': Paul Webster driving Platform efforts (AI Martin notify about {{bug|359719}})
+
* Martin: {{bug|380984}} ant / Orbit respin? - Unclear for now
+
* McQ: Finally figured out some long-standing bug eg "Variables view sometimes empty"
+
** Dani: It's 2 issues: First-time switch to Perspective deferred to 4.2.1, but {{bug|379818}} is finally fixed
+
** The actual underlying defect had been in there for years
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''May 16, 2012:''' - McQ, John, Dani, Martin
+
'''February 20, 2013''' - McQ, John, Dani, Martin, Andrew
* Dani: '''Version Number''' in branding features gets auto-generated and 3.8 version is now higher than 4.2 (since 3.8 build runs after 3.8)
+
* John: '''Orion Release Review''', please give feedback
** John thinks it's not a big deal
+
* John: '''CBI Patches''' - CBI has lots of patches downstream in their POM's ... RC2 is the last chance getting that in
+
** Auto-generating the POM.XML would be nice but that's not how things work today
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''May 9, 2012:''' - McQ, John, Dani
+
'''February 13, 2013'''
* John: Classic update can still be enabled via capabilities - should we remove it?
+
* {{bug|156134}} re-exporting debug dependencies
** Dani: in general "yes", but too late now
+
** McQ: too late, but make sure we do it for Kepler
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''May 2, 2012:''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, Andrew, John
+
'''February 6, 2013''' - John, Dani, Martin
* John: '''Forking of SWT''' 3.8 and 4.2 are now separate Streams with CTabFolder implementation being the only difference
+
* John: '''M5a and SR2 RC4'''
* Dani: '''Icons''' (not discussed)
+
* John: Pawel and Platform / Debug work (Pin & Clone)
 +
** Only adopt when it's really ready and satisfies all criteria, otherwise not into Kepler
 +
** Maybe pull out Debug plugins into a feature of their own ?
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''April 18, 2012:''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, Andrew, John
+
'''January 30, 2013''' - McQ, John, Dani, Martin, Andrew
* Martin: [[E4/Scripting]] initiative
+
* John: '''SR2 RC3''' looking good - want to know about any remaining issues
** McQ thinks the E4 Application Model should be exposed as a DOM to scripting .. anything other than utilizing the e4 DOM for hiding a view feels wrong
+
* Dani: '''Java 8 Update''' - Markus Keller will move from JDT UI to JDT Core, taking over JSR-308
*** Martin: Approach is very pragmatic - don't see anybody investing into new Frameworks at this point but converging on what already exists
+
* John: '''NODE Dependency in Orion (exempt pre-req)'''
*** If this goes towards macro recording, the recorder should utilize the e4 app model
+
** Not shipping NODE ourselves, pushing to NODE package manager instead (or clone from git)
** Signing up on the [https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/eclipse-scripting-dev eclipse-scripting-dev] mailing list will keep people in the loop (expect low volume)
+
** Andrew: Is it a workswith ?
* Dani: '''API Approval Process''' Approval on Bug plus sent to eclipse-pmc list (like last year)
+
** Martin: Is there any overlap with the Java portion ?
* John: '''PDE Committers''' - perception of not being open
+
*** The server code is completely distinct from Java, but the same client can interact with both
** McQ would like to see a plan item for next year "actively promote more committers from outside"
+
* Martin: [[Asterisk]] - will need a dialin for Dani in Switzerland; '''AI Dani''' forward his dialin to Martin for the time being
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''April 11, 2012:''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, Andrew, John
+
'''January 24, 2013''' -  
* Martin: '''LTS vs Quality/Fixes in Current Stream''' - Like John's reply making the link between the two
+
* Martin: '''4.3 and 3.8 dual-stream''' - [http://www.eclipse.org/projects/project-plan.php?projectid=webtools#themes_and_priorities Webtools project plan]
* McQ/John: '''Builds''' - Moving forward
+
** egit, mylyn, dtp have been doing both n + n-1 for a long time
* McQ: '''CBI Builds''' - Platform not going to take any ownership but will be a consumer like others - still shooting for Juno SR1
+
** Technically, running on both should be possible if Platform API is used (except for the changes in Theming)
* Andrew: '''4.2 Builds in Fedora 17''' - Testing now
+
** The Eclipse Community needs to advance the latest (4.3)
* McQ: '''IBM Ottawa Team moving to new building''' - expect delays during next couple days
+
** IBM product teams have been told not to forward at all if they can't forward to 4.x - shipping on 4.2
 +
** John: Having '''wider ranges of tolerance''' is something we should be able to do (otherwise our plugin system is failing)
 +
** John: Java8 will be the first killer feature in 4.x
 +
* Dani: '''Java 8'''
 +
** Will provide feature patches as soon as it makes sense - early draft, participating in expert group
 +
** Want to have the compiler and editor ready when Java 8 goes GA - initial refactoring etc in SR1 - full feature set in the next release
 +
* John: '''CBI update'''
 +
** Consider switch after M5
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''April 4, 2012:''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, Andrew
+
'''January 17, 2013''' - McQ, John, Martin
* Dani: '''VM Requirements''' - Help no longer works on Java 5, this surprised some people... but Project Plan talks about a Java 6 req now
+
* John: '''{{bug|397896}} EPP vs Classic'''
** Martin suggestion: on the "Required JVM" table in the Project Plan, add a 2nd column with closure of BREE including all pre-reqs (continue having 1st column the BREE of the bundle itself auto-generated)
+
** Could volunteer to own the EPP package from Platform POV
* Dani: '''Jeff still mentioned as PMC member'''
+
** Then Wayne would own the decision of RCP/RAP vs Classic - what's the difference, keep both or unify
** '''AI Dani''' send E-Mail
+
* John: '''Test Failures on I-Builds'''
* Martin: '''Concern about Platform Quality''' - eg SWT Redraws on 3.7.x - Old-time committers moving away
+
** Move away tests that have been failing for 9 months
** McQ: Platform team's focus will continue being maintenance, and new Platform support ... team's capacity is going down, but SWT is not affected mosted
+
** Dani: Most tests are actually down to 0 failures
** Martin: Code contributions are easy, hi-quality triage and review are harder
+
* John: '''CBI / Maven Builds'''
** Martin: Re-think the idea of having committers paid by the Foundation and Member Companies paying their share
+
** Appears to be fragile at the moment - Maven .micro releases are breaking the build!
*** Example: Why would Pascal review p2 in his sparetime ... but if he gets paid per bug his experience can be extremely valuable
+
*** Be more creative on resourcing side
+
** McQ: In favor of putting more structure in place similar to LTS ("hire people for fixes") ... just continue with LTS ?
+
*** IBM will have a need for fixes for at least another 8 years .. but that's a very self-serving focus
+
** [[Image:Ok_green.gif]] '''AI Martin''' send E-Mail to Mike to keep the ball rolling
+
* Dani: {{bug|375292}} '''Reference to Marketplace in the SDK'''
+
** Martin: "Classic" is a Building Block but "Packages" are for end users
+
** McQ: The purity of the SDK in itself isn't relevant
+
*** Martin: Why not just create a new package "Classic" which is at +3 and pulls in egit + marketplace ... the process for building is all in place, may just need a package reviewer
+
*** [[Image:Ok_green.gif]] '''AI Martin''' mail Markus
+
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''March 21, 2012:''' - McQ, Dani, Andrew, Martin
+
'''January 10, 2013''' - McQ, John, Dani, Martin
* McQ '''Oracle Java on Mac'''
+
* McQ: '''CBI''' - Switching Platform build to CBI for SR2 is not doable
* Dani '''denyNonFastForward'''
+
** Want to make CBI work for Juno since it's the LTS stream
* McQ '''JDT Team might see some losses'''
+
** CBI SDK builds are good at this point, it's only a couple of minor issues (shape of repos, download page, ...
* Andrew '''Running OpenJDK tests now on ARM''' :)
+
** When to switch to CBI in the Kepler Stream ? - Proposal do do it immediately
 +
* CBI patches waiting for Platform to pick up
  
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
'''March 14, 2012:''' - McQ, Andrew, Dani, John
+
'''January 3, 2013''' - McQ, Andrew, John, Dani
* Losing Eclipse project release engineer next week
+
* Andrew will recommend good conferences to promote Orion
* David Williams is stepping in to help with our builds until Juno
+
* Most immediate issue is that our build needs elevated privileges to tag, sign, and promote builds
+
** kmoir was the only committer with sufficient privileges
+
** We either need to give another committer sufficient rights, or give build user access it needs
+
** Could use hooks to ensure build user isn't doing anything other than tagging
+
** All agreed the build user approach was the best option. John to open bug against foundation to carry it out
+
  
<hr/>
 
'''March 7, 2012:''' - McQ, Andrew, Martin, John
 
* John: '''API Deletions''' {{bug|370248}} - PMC agrees.
 
* McQ: '''Common Build Infrastructure at the Foundation'''
 
** Shipping Platform Juno bits built by PDE ... but Foundation wants EPP packages built by Tycho; Platform can't support this
 
*** Reason might be that 4.2 is planned to be the start of LTS and VLTS .. ok for now if LTS bits are different since not publicly available
 
*** Plus, LTS really starts after Juno SR2 ... Platform might be in a better position for Tycho by then
 
*** In Linux, Fedora also builds by themselves ... but assumption is that people come to Fedora support first
 
** Martin, Andrew really concerned about fragmentation and duplication of effort ... eg what if the qualifiers don't match
 
** Should be treated as proof of concept but not publicly available until Juno SR2, in order to avoid fragmentation !
 
 
<hr/>
 
'''February 29, 2012:''' - Dani, McQ, John, Martin, Andrew
 
* John: Orion team received a box full of '''Black Ducks''' to honour their Black Duck Rookie of the Year award
 
* Dani: '''Gerrit Move'''
 
** John: Important information needs to stay in Bugzilla ... don't pull from outside git exclusively
 
* Andrew: '''Platform Defect Contest'''
 
** McQ concern: Lots of duplicate bugs would take focus away from the team
 
** Martin: Could encourage triage as part of the contest, and only count good/new bugs
 
** John: Some low-hanging fruit bugs in Platform UI but not necessarily in 4.x ("helpwanted")
 
** John: Re-introduce the "greatbug" keyword ?
 
*** A greatbug is relevant, new, good description that helps understanding/finding the issue; ideally with a patch.
 
*** Resolution: '''AI John''' send note to Mike
 
* John: '''PDE API Moved'''
 
** Some internal, provisional API was migrated to full API in this release
 
** Someone from SAP (Dimitar Giormov) Asked adding back the provisional API such that they could support 2 versions of Eclipse with one codebase
 
** McQ: Would have helped them 4 years ago .. but at the moment don't have enough people
 
*** McQ: Question how pervasive their use of the old API is ... how much Reflection would they need to put int
 
*** One resolution could be OK but only if they provide all the patches
 
** This kind of duplication is error prone and adds a maintenance burden on the project
 
 
<hr/>
 
'''February 22, 2012:''' - Dani, McQ, John, Andrew
 
* Repeat of PDE build discussion from last week. We decided to nominate John Arthorne as a committer so we at least have someone to accept community patches. We will revisit after Juno and perhaps do a larger restructuring
 
* Communication with eGit: We have written some patches for eGit that have been growing stale. Dani will review the patches, and then send an email to eGit lead asking if there is a particular reason for not accepting them. If there is no problem with the patches we will track down an eGit committer to release them.
 
* Andrew asked about process for approving CQs:
 
** Any PMC member can feel free to approve CQs
 
** New versions of existing third party libraries are a no-brainer, typically just +1 right away
 
** For new third party libraries we may need a PMC discussion about why the library is needed, what feature it will live in, etc
 
** For code contributions just make sure the legal process has been followed and then +1. We generally trust the judgement of the committer who will process the contribution.
 
 
<hr/>
 
'''February 15, 2012:''' - Dani, McQ, John
 
* Some discussion of what to do with PDE Build, which lacks committers. PDE as a whole has barely enough committers to be a functioning project, so maybe we should be looking at a larger restructuring after
 
Juno rather than one piece at a time. We lacked quorum to make a decision so we will defer discussion to another week.
 
 
 
<hr/>
 
'''February 8, 2012:''' - Dani, Martin, Andrew, McQ
 
* Andrew: Eclipse stand at '''FOSDEM in Brussles'''
 
** Lots of people just dropped by to say hi and thanks
 
** Mike Milinkovich was showing off Orion; Gunnar and Andrew did others (Web, EclipseRT, C/C++)
 
* McQ: '''4.2 Quality''' ... current list of defects looks manageable to tick all off .. any messaging we want to do ?
 
 
<hr/>
 
'''February 1, 2012:''' - Dani, Martin, John
 
* Dani: '''No UA Committers any more''' - move UA under Platform UI such that at least somebody can apply patches
 
** AI John check with Wayne ... UA is a subcomponent now, may not even need a move review.
 
* Dani: {{bug|343150}} git '''DenyNonFastForward'''
 
** Orion could eventually add tooling to support easy workflows in spite of deny on the repo ... but not in this release
 
** Ping on the bug again and proceed
 
* John: Decide when to switch 4.2 builds from re-using 3.x binary bundles vs full 4.x builds
 
** Today, the 4.x testsuite just tests 4.x specific stuff; things like JDT tests just run against 3.8 today
 
** Today, cannot generate Javadocs in 4.x today sine it needs the full source
 
** Today, nightlies are running 3.x only (could change to running 4.x nightlies only)
 
** Today, 3.x builds run at IBM and 4.x builds run at Eclipse.org
 
** Only few test failures left in the 4.x builds --&gt; ready to switch
 
** AI: '''Kim''' to send 4.x test results to the mailing list, consider switching right after M5
 
** '''Performance Tests:''' Not yet run on 4.x yet - should be able to run on Denis' vserver
 
*** IBM is going to lose the physical machines for performance tests in 2 weeks ! (Going to migrate to vserver too!)
 
*** Need a new baseline
 
** Andrew: at '''FOSSLC''' in Brussels this week, going to represent Eclipse with Mike Milinkovich, Gunnar Wagenknecht and others
 
* '''Gerrit''': Platform won't jump in as an early adopter this time, wait for other projects first
 
** Not all Platform Unittests can run on Hudson today (need at least some fingerprint tests to get value from Gerrit)
 
 
<hr/>
 
'''January 25, 2012:''' - McQ, John, Martin, Andrew, Dani
 
* McQ: '''Note about 4.2 on Release Train'''
 
* Andrew: '''Eclipse 4.2 for Fedora''' - Feature note written for Eclipse Juno led to some discussion at Eng.Steering Committee, but finally approved
 
* Dani: Team down by 1 but no impact (Dani is going to take over responsibilities)
 
* John: '''Build Failures in UA, Update, PDE, p2 yesterday''' after the move to Java 7... nobody watching these, need to find caretakers
 
** UA tests often fail due to a link validity checker, these can be caused by anyone
 
** Certificate Validity issue (Jar signing)
 
 
 
<hr/>
 
'''January 18, 2012:''' - McQ, John, Martin, Andrew, Dani
 
* McQ: '''4.2 quality''' and next steps
 
** More resources found to enable 4.2 as the LTS base - encouraging, although some items still missing
 
** Fedora 17 think about shipping 4.2m6 (work ongoing) - that would be a large stack on top of 4.2
 
** John: '''Oracle Java 7 as Reference Platform''' now that the most severe issues are fixed (Java 6 EOL is June 2012 !) - that is Oracle, not OpenJDK
 
*** Not remove Java 6 for now
 
*** Fedora also does all tests on 7
 
 
<hr/>
 
'''January 11, 2012:''' - McQ, John, Dani, Martin, Andrew
 
* McQ: '''State of Presentation API's'''
 
** Different API's in 4.2 and 3.x -- will need to deprecate API in 3.x
 
** Christian suggested deleting API that's not implemented in 4.x to get compile errors ... John thinks that binary compatibility is more important
 
*** Plugins will be "mostly OK", presentation API is cosmetic anyways
 
** McQ: get in touch with clients who use presentation API, telling them what's best to do ... often newer 4.x infrastructure is much better than trying to keep 3.x around forever
 
* Andrew: '''Cairo and GTK3'''
 
* John: '''4.2 compiling now'''
 
* Martin: '''Updated JSch-0.1.44 version''' - how to announce properly
 
** AI Martin Announce on eclipse-dev and cross-project
 
** Should also put into migrtion notes and README
 
 
<hr/>
 
'''January 4, 2012:''' - McQ, Dani, Martin, Andrew
 
* McQ: Pascal's note about p2 leadership .. not sure who could step in and make a commitment (may see the same fate as UA)
 
** Tom Watson looking for candidates, but looks like none in McQ's team
 
 
<hr/>
 
<hr/>
  
 
= Archive =
 
= Archive =
 +
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2012 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2012]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2011 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2011]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2011 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2011]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2010 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2010]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2010 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2010]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2009 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2009]]
 
* [[Eclipse/PMC/Minutes 2009 | Archive of Meeting Minutes from 2009]]

Revision as of 15:48, 15 May 2013

Documents

Some documents written and/or used by the PMC:

Meeting Schedule

The Eclipse Project PMC has a weekly phone meeting every wednesday at 10.30am EST.

Meeting Minutes

May 15, 2013 - Dani, Martin, John, McQ

  • John: Switching focus from Orion to Eclipse Platform for the endgame - will be away first week of June
  • Mike Milinkovich did a demo on Orion in the Zurich lab and at the Eclipse Stammtisch Zurich

May 8, 2013 - Dani, Martin, John, Andrew, McQ

  • Dani: bug 403149 Removing Tycho Dependency - AI John comment on the bug
    • Martin would like to see a simple Doc page somewhere that explains how to fix the versions
    • Dani thinks that any serious build would update pom versions automatically as part of the build
  • Martin: bug 402509 context menu filtering - request gentle nudge
  • John: Will switch to Asterisk for the PMC from next week on - AI McQ update the invite

May 1, 2013 - John, Dani, Andrew, McQ

  • John: LTS now running IBM Juno maintenance builds in LTS forge. Some small details still being worked out.
  • Dani: Gerrit can be configured to deny non-fast-forward merges. We agreed to request that all Eclipse project Gerrit repositories be configured in this way. See bug 402791 for details.
  • Dani: Request for JUnit bundle to stop re-exporting Hamcrest bundle. Hamcrest was originally part of JUnit so this was done for compatibility reasons. We agreed that we will not do this because it breaks all users of JUnit bundle. See bug 403676 for details.

April 24, 2013 - John, Dani, Martin

  • Dani: Upload Freeze Plan
  • Dani: Java 8 Update
  • John: Pawel stepping down as Platform/Debug Lead
    • Leaves Pin & Clone orphaned for next year. Working sets for expression view also not in Kepler.

April 17, 2013 - John, Dani, Martin

  • Martin: New Classic Package - Will commit SDK branding, and Egit Capability def
    • CSS - Should inherit proper styling from Platform (most probably OK)
  • John: API Baselines - remind teams to set API baselines
  • Martin: bug 402509 context menu filtering - request gentle nudge
  • John: Triage of Platform UI issues to be addressed



April 3, 2013 - McQ, Dani, John, Andrew

  • John: Kepler draft plan update ready, please take a look and provide comments
  • We discussed EclipseCon. It was a very good event for Eclipse project. On desktop community is moving forward on Eclipse 4. There was lots of good feedback, and very little grumbling. Orion was very well represented, lots of talks and demos from several companies adopting it.

March 20, 2013 - McQ, Dani, Martin, Andrew

  • Dani: Java 8 - jdt.core making very good progress - almost everything compiles in the editor
  • Dani: pom files update - to be discussed in the arch call
  • Martin: bug 402509 Context Menus - no feedback, ping again
  • Martin: bug 145635 Pin & Clone
    • Dani - the feature itself is good and makes sense, would also like it in JDT
    • The UI metaphor is new and would need some testing in the Field - McQ would like the patch in ASAP in a way that doesn't cause more swirl to start experimenting
    • CDT would need to adopt it, upstream changes needed
    • Current implementation showed quite a lot of ripples and bugs
      • Current impl breaks existing workflows, that's the big problem
    • John: only 1 milestone left, if it appears in M7 and breaks any adopters they have little time to react;
      • Can loop-in JDT and CDT, but there might be others ...
      • Was PTP involved in any way ? They could also be broken, they have very special requirements
    • McQ: Do we have ownership of this work ? - If we have a clear need and a clear owner working on it we could give it a try
    • AI Martin (1) Clarify with CDT why they didn't like the feature and what are their plans; all the rest comes after that eg PTP, Pawel, can it be done in a non-breaking way
  • John: bug 402912 Significant Memory Leak in M6 fixed this week: noticable if eclipse running for a long time
    • Workaround for M6: Turn off Workbench Autosave feature by setting it to 0
    • AI Post to cross-project - people doing demos at Eclipsecon might want to use the workaround
  • Martin: bug 397896 New Classic Package - initial package done but unusable while the SDK branding bundle's contents is not migrated
    • Martin will continue pushing for this to happen - fallback would be not
    • Not much risk in judging whether it's good or not, only binary diff needed
  • John: bug 380325 Java 7 filesystem fragment
    • McQ do we know performance implications, could we get rid of the native bundles ?
    • Martin would like to have the fragment in all builds, to make it easier to test performance etc implications
  • Martin: bug 403589 eclipse.inf
    • Different binary bits depending on distribution channel is bad ... Tycho removed
    • Defect in post-processing (why does it add eclipse.inf) or defect in bundle preparation (why isn't eclipse.inf in there) ?
    • Maybe related to pack200 conditioning - Martin thinks that eclipse.inf was used in the past as a marker to know whether pack200 conditioning has happened ... now downstream aggregator conditions and adds eclipse.inf
    • AI John investigate

March 13, 2013 - McQ, John, Martin, Dani

  • Andrew: bug 397896 final throughts on the EPP package
    • Move forward with [1]
    • Testing - could find someone if it's just "use during the test pass"
    • Q: Can the EPP build be done frequently so it's available 1 week before the milestone for testing ?
  • Martin: bug 402509 context menu filtering
    • Would like to get some advice from Platform on the approach; some trajectory of a solution moving forward
    • Not a must-have for Kepler, but would like to see where this is heading
    • AI McQ find Platform folk to discuss this
  • John: Eclipse 4 API Status
    • Publishing a "usable subset" of the former provisional API as final: model, core services; consume injection
    • Allows building a real Eclipse 4 App now on API
      • Mostly clean-up, documentation; removing some bad stuff
      • Writing an App on Kepler E4 API might actually be able to run on Juno
    • Some of the advanced stuff remains provisional for now, eg define injection
  • John: Plan Update - No permission to update in the PMI
  • McQ: CBI / Bad Launcher
    • Have an idea that doing some little extra work after the CBI build might be good enough for now
    • HP-UX CBI Build doesn't start out of the box (will likely stay a known issue for M6)
  • Martin: bug 380325 Java7 EFS Plugin: Build ?

March 6, 2013 - McQ, John, Martin, Andrew

  • Martin: bug 402509 context menu filtering
    • AI Martin ask engineers document what we're doing today
  • Martin: bug 397896 EPP vs Classic - how to proceed
    • Martin's recent findings on Marketplace
      • There's p2, Marketplace, Packages in the Open but they are only parts of the solution
      • There's commercial installers from EclipseSource (Yoxos), Genuitec, IBM
      • John: p2 simplified UI (eg Webtools Server Adaptors; Mylyn)
    • What's missing ? David too booked ?
  • John: CBI Builds in Kepler - SDK in good shape but repo and Equinox downloadpage not quite right yet, some might take until M6
  • John: Delete old Platform/UI Branches - any PMC Policy ? No, convert branches to tags
  • John: API Freeze next week - some (modest) new Eclipse 4 API's
    • McQ recommends going for a "complete, but minimal subset of what people will want to do", rather than too many convenience methods
    • John: Some API has been provisional for 3 years - can't make wholesale changes now for the fun of it
      • May phase in some changes by adding @noreference rather than deleting stuff
      • In some cases there's pressure to use interfaces rather than classes, in order to be able and leverage Java 8 constructs
  • Orion - anybody going to JSConf ?

February 27, 2013 - John, Andrew, Dani

  • Nothing noteworthy

February 20, 2013 - McQ, John, Dani, Martin, Andrew

  • John: Orion Release Review, please give feedback

February 13, 2013


February 6, 2013 - John, Dani, Martin

  • John: M5a and SR2 RC4
  • John: Pawel and Platform / Debug work (Pin & Clone)
    • Only adopt when it's really ready and satisfies all criteria, otherwise not into Kepler
    • Maybe pull out Debug plugins into a feature of their own ?

January 30, 2013 - McQ, John, Dani, Martin, Andrew

  • John: SR2 RC3 looking good - want to know about any remaining issues
  • Dani: Java 8 Update - Markus Keller will move from JDT UI to JDT Core, taking over JSR-308
  • John: NODE Dependency in Orion (exempt pre-req)
    • Not shipping NODE ourselves, pushing to NODE package manager instead (or clone from git)
    • Andrew: Is it a workswith ?
    • Martin: Is there any overlap with the Java portion ?
      • The server code is completely distinct from Java, but the same client can interact with both

January 24, 2013 -

  • Martin: 4.3 and 3.8 dual-stream - Webtools project plan
    • egit, mylyn, dtp have been doing both n + n-1 for a long time
    • Technically, running on both should be possible if Platform API is used (except for the changes in Theming)
    • The Eclipse Community needs to advance the latest (4.3)
    • IBM product teams have been told not to forward at all if they can't forward to 4.x - shipping on 4.2
    • John: Having wider ranges of tolerance is something we should be able to do (otherwise our plugin system is failing)
    • John: Java8 will be the first killer feature in 4.x
  • Dani: Java 8
    • Will provide feature patches as soon as it makes sense - early draft, participating in expert group
    • Want to have the compiler and editor ready when Java 8 goes GA - initial refactoring etc in SR1 - full feature set in the next release
  • John: CBI update
    • Consider switch after M5

January 17, 2013 - McQ, John, Martin

  • John: bug 397896 EPP vs Classic
    • Could volunteer to own the EPP package from Platform POV
    • Then Wayne would own the decision of RCP/RAP vs Classic - what's the difference, keep both or unify
  • John: Test Failures on I-Builds
    • Move away tests that have been failing for 9 months
    • Dani: Most tests are actually down to 0 failures
  • John: CBI / Maven Builds
    • Appears to be fragile at the moment - Maven .micro releases are breaking the build!

January 10, 2013 - McQ, John, Dani, Martin

  • McQ: CBI - Switching Platform build to CBI for SR2 is not doable
    • Want to make CBI work for Juno since it's the LTS stream
    • CBI SDK builds are good at this point, it's only a couple of minor issues (shape of repos, download page, ...
    • When to switch to CBI in the Kepler Stream ? - Proposal do do it immediately
  • CBI patches waiting for Platform to pick up

January 3, 2013 - McQ, Andrew, John, Dani

  • Andrew will recommend good conferences to promote Orion

Archive

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