Notice: this Wiki will be going read only early in 2024 and edits will no longer be possible. Please see: https://gitlab.eclipse.org/eclipsefdn/helpdesk/-/wikis/Wiki-shutdown-plan for the plan.
Architecture Council/Minutes September 11 2008
Meeting Title: | Architecture Council Monthly Meeting |
Date & Time: | Thursday September 11, 2008 at 1500 UTC / 0800 SFO / 1100 Ottawa / 1600 London / 1700 Berlin HTML | iCal |
Dial-in: | (+1) 613.287.8000 (Ottawa and international) or 866.362.7064 (toll-free North America) passcode 464440# |
Contents
Attendees
- Sign up here (alphabetical by last name), since it's hard to catch all names during the call.
- Signed-up: John Arthorne, Wayne "Mad Dog" Beaton, Boris Bokowski, Eugene Chan, Brian Fitzpatrick, Philippe Mulet, Martin Oberhuber, Michael Scharf, August Schmidt, Darin Swanson, Thomas Watson, Darin Wright
- Tentative: John Duimovich, David Williams (will join late, if my conflict ends early)
- Regrets: Oliver Cole (standing meeting), John Graham(last minute client mtg), Richard Gronback (travelling), Mik Kersten (travelling), Markus Knauer (g-Eclipse tutorial), Andrew Overholt (meeting conflict), Gunnar Wagenknecht (city council meeting), John Wiegand (travelling)
Agenda / Notes
- Feel free to edit, but not during the call!
Review of Action Items
- Last meeting Architecture Council/Minutes August 14 2008#Action Items
- Boris to start Architecture Council/Top Ten Recommendations
- Martin to draft an E-Mail to eclipse.org-committers for review, inviting to put EAC on CC of bugs
- Martin to send E-Mail to EAC list as a reminder for "Architectural Walkthrough".
- Mik to create initial "architectural walkthrough" material for mylyn. One more to follow before publicly announcing?
- MichaelS to draft an E-Mail about the "plugin granularity" idea, searching for people to lead the effort
- Bjorn or Anne to add a "year of appointment" to members on the councils page
- Martin to propose alternate meeting scheme on the mailing list
- Everyone to think about time commitments that can be made for "architectural things" at Eclipse (3 hours == 1 hr meeting + 2 hrs E-Mail and mentoring)
- Everyone to propose new members on the mailing list
- Martin to create bugzilla bugs for the ISchedulingRule (bug 246840 and LGPL {bug|246945}} discussions
Administrative
- Meeting Dates - any additional comments? The vote was to keep 2nd thursday of each month (and I propose moving to tuesday as first choice in case there is a public holiday or other conflict on thursday).
- EAC and bugzilla, and the E-Mail to Committers
- Spamming the list already?
- Virtual inbox (eac-inbox@eclipse.org) or direct mailing list address as bugzilla user?
- Who wants to be a secret-keeper of the EAC user's bugzilla password?
- Architecture Council/Members and Mentors - is it accurate?
- What projects should have a mentor? (Every / Incubation / Those who ask / ...?)
- Who's mentoring Apogee?
- What to do with the COSMOS and Aperi projects, which seem mentorless after Harm Sluiman quit
- Can we (auto)generate a list of mentor-less projects?
- Other wishes for re-assigning mentorship?
- Should the list express some "area of expertise" with mentors like "technical/coder" vs. "management" ?
- Dormant Status Proposal:
- Do the 3 month / 1 year times make sense?
- Mike needs to sign off changes in membership
- New Member Proposals:
- Are we too big a crowd already? New Member Proposals?
- Some ideas (from E4 mostly): Dave Carver, Tom Schindl, Scott Lewis, Konstantin Kommissarchik, Kevin McGuire, David Orme, Paul Webster, Paul Coltron
- Google Calendar Bugs and Requests -- does anybody know how to report them?
- Changing an event, "Dont send" does send notifications
- Response from to mailing list invitation should track attendance of each member separately
- Welcome Gunnar Wagenknecht as Technology PMC representative to the Architecture Council
News from the Board (EMO)
- We have board reps and EMO reps on the council (Mike, Bjorn, Jeff, Ed, zx, Mik and Doug Gaff; Wayne)
- Would like to have a standing "news from the board" topic, since as mentors we should be top informed
- Other channels (PlanetEclipse, Blog, Committers / Project-leads mailing list, ...) should work but 1st-hand is better
- Do information channels work well?
Top Ten Recommendations
- Architecture Council/Top Ten Recommendations
- More recommendations?
- Add links into some code which exposes a recommendation as example?
- Could easily convert a Recommendation into an article / blog post / ... ("The EAC Series")
Deadlocks, Jobs and Scheduling
- Examples: bug 245573 comment 12 (Dali JPA Tools Deadlock, John CC'd to EAC); bug 246840 discussion about ISchedulingRule (saving project preferences)
- What is causing issues?
- work performed during class loading (Activator.start()) - unknown context
- work performed in callbacks - unknown context
- Job / SchedulingRule intermixed with Resources - cannot extend rules after the fact, need to know who locks what internally
- What can we do to make the Platform safer for Concurrency?
- Come up with some items in our Architecture Council/Top Ten Recommendations (e.g. avoid synchronous callbacks, avoid in Activator.start(), static initializers or Singleton getters) - a general recommendation could be to avoid performing work at unpredictable times, but that would recommend against lazy initialization in general
- Does anybody have a well-working, consistent model on top of the current infrastructure?
- Totally new concurrency mechanism as part of E4 ?
- David Orme mentions DataBinding Realms and the Threads Considered Harmful blog which references Erlang message-based concurrence
- Would it help to become more asynchronous under the hood, even if old APIs need to remain for compatibility?
- Are there any other good known models for concurrency?
- Better Javadoc ?
- Example: ISchedulingRule.isConflicting() vs. ISchedulingRule.contains(), and how does it relate to RuleFactory and MultiRule?
- Articles ? - John referenced the resouce-deltas article
LGPL Works-with vs. Requires
How to start Releng?
- Question from a new project: I am trying to create some update sites and build scripts for TmL and I am having some difficults to find some reference material to working with this. Do you have any idea where I can find a starter material to do that??
- Bjorn, NickB & Denis Build Workshop 3: Build Hard With A Purpose but is that an answer for now? Current status?
- Refer people to clone existing projects' releng? Which ones are good?
- Refer to the PDE Build docs? But that's only half of the story?
Other Ideas for Discussion
- Mentoring New Projects
- Experiences? What could be improved?
- Webpage improvements: more pre-canned content for new projects (like Sourceforge)?
- Mentoring Galileo: What could be improved?
- Running each project's unittests with full Galileo installed; especially interesting for Performance tests
- Don't duplicate work done by the Planning Council
- Integrated bug reporting: Mylyn is providing a bug/error/enhancement reporting facility that will provide a flexible and product-configurable mapping between features, bundles and bug trackers bug 212209 (Example: http://wiki.eclipse.org/images/8/86/Mylyn-Bug-Reporting-Example.jpg ). Do we want this for Galileo?
- E4 now has bi-weekly calls -- won't discuss E4 on the EAC unless asked / invited
- Eclipse Pain Points
- Performance & Memory Footprint, Bloat
- Restrictions on Resource model (Maven)
- IP due diligence and the processes around it
- Lots of these issues are already worked on by E4, and/or Committer Representatives at the Board, and/or the Planning Council
- But the EAC's charter includes identifying and naming pain pionts... anything not yet being addressed?
- Re-activate Top Ten Architectural Problems in all of Eclipse ?
- Re-activate Architecture Council Discovery and Reuse Activity ?