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Difference between revisions of "Talk:Eclipse Educational Screencam Planning"
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1. My focus at this point is to come up with a general plan, simliar to what you have already put on the page, and then figure out which 1 or 2 videos are the most important to start with. Then, I can create the first video and we can use that as a pilot project. Is that similar to what you have in mind? | 1. My focus at this point is to come up with a general plan, simliar to what you have already put on the page, and then figure out which 1 or 2 videos are the most important to start with. Then, I can create the first video and we can use that as a pilot project. Is that similar to what you have in mind? | ||
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| + | ''[Wayne] Sounds good to me.'' | ||
2. What's the most important priority that training videos could help with? (e.g., make it easier for newbies to get started?) | 2. What's the most important priority that training videos could help with? (e.g., make it easier for newbies to get started?) | ||
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| + | ''[Wayne] We get a lot of newbie questions on the eclipse.newcomer group. Given a choice, I think that this is a good place to start.'' | ||
3. Which do you think is more important: to draw in new people who are new to Java and maybe OOP or to draw in experienced Java developers who are not using Eclipse? (I would guess that it's a harder sell for people who are already familiar with other IDE's, but that is just a guess.) Or are both equally important? | 3. Which do you think is more important: to draw in new people who are new to Java and maybe OOP or to draw in experienced Java developers who are not using Eclipse? (I would guess that it's a harder sell for people who are already familiar with other IDE's, but that is just a guess.) Or are both equally important? | ||
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| + | ''[Wayne] Well, frankly, both. But let's start with whatever is easier and work from there. Chances are the "new to Java" crowd is probably a good starting point.'' | ||
4. For Java / OOP novices, I think a series starting from scratch and building a simple app, including UI, would be good. The nice thing about the video format is that you can show people things and explain them just enough to pique their interest without getting too bogged down. And obviously there are a lot of resources for learning Java. | 4. For Java / OOP novices, I think a series starting from scratch and building a simple app, including UI, would be good. The nice thing about the video format is that you can show people things and explain them just enough to pique their interest without getting too bogged down. And obviously there are a lot of resources for learning Java. | ||
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| + | ''[Wayne] I think it's important to keep them as concise as possible. If makes sense to do a long video, so be it, but I'd rather keep them as short as possible. People have work to do; they can't sit around watching videos all day :-). Having said that, I think you should probably start with some very simple Java (i.e. no GUI or other distractions) and then progress to doing something that builds a Swing or SWT GUI, or even a servlet (though maybe we should push J2EE a little further down on the list).'' | ||
5. For existing Java developers, we could perhaps start with a "sales demo" video. In other words, we could identify the killer features of Eclipse vs. the leading competitors and make sure to highlight those features ("have you ever had to change a method signature .... with Eclipse it's easy"). | 5. For existing Java developers, we could perhaps start with a "sales demo" video. In other words, we could identify the killer features of Eclipse vs. the leading competitors and make sure to highlight those features ("have you ever had to change a method signature .... with Eclipse it's easy"). | ||
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| + | ''[Wayne] I tend to shy away from comparisons between Eclipse and competitors. There's just no value in it for us (all it does is draw attention to the competitor). We tend also to stay away from "sales demos", but I think I understand what you mean (words can be a little distracting sometimes). Having an "advanced" video that shows some of the killer features would be cool. I was sort of going this direction with the test first stuff.'' | ||
Let me know what you think. Thanks. | Let me know what you think. Thanks. | ||
Another thought on the whole issue of simplyfying the orientation of newcomers -- what about a role-based road map? Something like: If you are a ... , start here ... | Another thought on the whole issue of simplyfying the orientation of newcomers -- what about a role-based road map? Something like: If you are a ... , start here ... | ||
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| + | ''[Wayne] I think that would be great.'' | ||
Software development manager -- Why Java and why Eclipse; Eclipse as an IDE and a sample RCP application, etc.; Overview of Eclipse Project and Technologies; Business Case for Eclipse. | Software development manager -- Why Java and why Eclipse; Eclipse as an IDE and a sample RCP application, etc.; Overview of Eclipse Project and Technologies; Business Case for Eclipse. | ||
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Yet one more thought. I just went through your Rich Client slide show. I know as a software developer, one of the first things I wanted to see when I was looking at dev platforms was the type of apps you could create. The screen shots of the example apps (ForeFlight, RSS, Nasa, Lotus) are very impressive. Would it be desirable and possible to create short (5-minute) screencam demos of one or more of these products? | Yet one more thought. I just went through your Rich Client slide show. I know as a software developer, one of the first things I wanted to see when I was looking at dev platforms was the type of apps you could create. The screen shots of the example apps (ForeFlight, RSS, Nasa, Lotus) are very impressive. Would it be desirable and possible to create short (5-minute) screencam demos of one or more of these products? | ||
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| + | ''[Wayne] I think the right approach would be to talk to the folks who have created the products and see what we can do to help them do the video themselves. I'm quite sure the RSSOwl folks would be keen.'' | ||
Revision as of 22:53, 15 April 2007
Hi Wayne. I'm new to editing Wiki's, so please be sure to let me know if I'm not doing this the best way. From looking at the Wikipedia tutorial, it looks like the "talk" page is the best way to ask questions vs. actually making edits. At this point, I have more questions than edits. Here are some to get started.
1. My focus at this point is to come up with a general plan, simliar to what you have already put on the page, and then figure out which 1 or 2 videos are the most important to start with. Then, I can create the first video and we can use that as a pilot project. Is that similar to what you have in mind?
[Wayne] Sounds good to me.
2. What's the most important priority that training videos could help with? (e.g., make it easier for newbies to get started?)
[Wayne] We get a lot of newbie questions on the eclipse.newcomer group. Given a choice, I think that this is a good place to start.
3. Which do you think is more important: to draw in new people who are new to Java and maybe OOP or to draw in experienced Java developers who are not using Eclipse? (I would guess that it's a harder sell for people who are already familiar with other IDE's, but that is just a guess.) Or are both equally important?
[Wayne] Well, frankly, both. But let's start with whatever is easier and work from there. Chances are the "new to Java" crowd is probably a good starting point.
4. For Java / OOP novices, I think a series starting from scratch and building a simple app, including UI, would be good. The nice thing about the video format is that you can show people things and explain them just enough to pique their interest without getting too bogged down. And obviously there are a lot of resources for learning Java.
[Wayne] I think it's important to keep them as concise as possible. If makes sense to do a long video, so be it, but I'd rather keep them as short as possible. People have work to do; they can't sit around watching videos all day :-). Having said that, I think you should probably start with some very simple Java (i.e. no GUI or other distractions) and then progress to doing something that builds a Swing or SWT GUI, or even a servlet (though maybe we should push J2EE a little further down on the list).
5. For existing Java developers, we could perhaps start with a "sales demo" video. In other words, we could identify the killer features of Eclipse vs. the leading competitors and make sure to highlight those features ("have you ever had to change a method signature .... with Eclipse it's easy").
[Wayne] I tend to shy away from comparisons between Eclipse and competitors. There's just no value in it for us (all it does is draw attention to the competitor). We tend also to stay away from "sales demos", but I think I understand what you mean (words can be a little distracting sometimes). Having an "advanced" video that shows some of the killer features would be cool. I was sort of going this direction with the test first stuff.
Let me know what you think. Thanks.
Another thought on the whole issue of simplyfying the orientation of newcomers -- what about a role-based road map? Something like: If you are a ... , start here ...
[Wayne] I think that would be great.
Software development manager -- Why Java and why Eclipse; Eclipse as an IDE and a sample RCP application, etc.; Overview of Eclipse Project and Technologies; Business Case for Eclipse.
Experienced developer new to Java and OOP -- Eclipse / Java Absolute Beginner video's
Anyway, just a thought. Thanks.
Yet one more thought. I just went through your Rich Client slide show. I know as a software developer, one of the first things I wanted to see when I was looking at dev platforms was the type of apps you could create. The screen shots of the example apps (ForeFlight, RSS, Nasa, Lotus) are very impressive. Would it be desirable and possible to create short (5-minute) screencam demos of one or more of these products?
[Wayne] I think the right approach would be to talk to the folks who have created the products and see what we can do to help them do the video themselves. I'm quite sure the RSSOwl folks would be keen.